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REDUX Absinthe - Golden Moon Distillery


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#1 JosephLabrecque

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Posted 06 March 2013 - 08:42 AM

Anyone know anything about REDUX Absinthe out of Golden, CO?  Apparently they've just won a Silver Medal for this absinthe at the Denver International Spirits Awards. Also, happily, Overland Distillery (Trinity Absinthe) won a GOLD at this same event (good for them!)

 

The Golden Moon Distillery website is pretty empty and I cannot find anything here at TWS in terms of reviews or forum mentions.

 

 

From http://goldenmoondis...oducts_new.html

REDUX Absinthe is the product of years of research using an extensive library of rare distillation texts, coupled with the tasting and testing of rare vintage Absinthes. The result is a premium Absinthe that is both a classic traditional Absinthe Verte, and a unique new creation at the same time.

REDUX Absinthe is made using the finest herbs and spices from around the world, all carefully selected and processed using the artisanal small-batch methods that were used by premium Absinthe distillers during the height of the Belle Epoque era.

 

Always interested in local absinthe distilleries!



#2 greytail

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Posted 06 March 2013 - 10:21 AM

"....extensive library of rare distillation techniques"?

Hmmm.

Edited by greytail, 06 March 2013 - 10:22 AM.

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#3 Ambear

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Posted 06 March 2013 - 10:24 AM

I heard something about how Redux used to be elsewhere, and then moved to Colorado. If they placed behind Trinity, they probably aren't that great.


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#4 TheLoucheyMonster!

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Posted 06 March 2013 - 11:21 AM

Placement in a spirits competition does not mean it is any better or worse IMO.  Stock what value what you will on spirits competitions, but the absinthe has been getting some kind of award recognition since 2009

 

Redux has been in a state of development for many years.  You can find some older threads on FV , member name "Tirador" there, and here on WS.

http://www.feeverte....wtopic=5172&hl=

 

For the most up to date information, check out the FB page here:

http://www.facebook....nMoonDistillery

 

Maybe you Denver locals can get a distillery tour and or tasting?  :mbanana: 



#5 Absomphe

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Posted 06 March 2013 - 11:25 AM

Placement in a spirits competition does not mean it is any better or worse IMO. 

Agreed.

 

Particularly if it's solely an absinthe competition.


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#6 Evan Camomile

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Posted 06 March 2013 - 08:23 PM

Anyone know anything about REDUX Absinthe out of Golden, CO?  Apparently they've just won a Silver Medal for this absinthe at the Denver International Spirits Awards. Also, happily, Overland Distillery (Trinity Absinthe) won a GOLD at this same event (good for them!)


 

Always interested in local absinthe distilleries!

One thing you will learn quickly is that pan-spirit competitions often don't know enough to really hand out medals to absinthe. The awareness is growing but it's just not there yet. I'm not knocking either absinthe it's just I have this issue with awards and methods of competitions.

I'm very happy for Amanda and Joe Pawelski, knowing them and how hard they work just to get Trinity to market let alone in competitions is humbling. But that doesn't mean the judges knew squat, truth be told you could very well be a better judge.

Absinthe specific competitions have their own probllems. Being a niche market often qualified judges are also distillers and having a producer judge their own absinthe, often not blind, leads to bias.

 

Right now there is not a single competition that I hold in high regards for absinthe awards. I hear that might change with an absinthe specific event where no one producer/representative sits on the judges panel and the tastings are blind, but that has yet to actually happen. The best we have right now are educated consumer reviews. I trust WS scores more than medals any day of the week. They hold more authenticity than a competition that once gave swill like La Fee a medal, or Pernod, or Absente, etc. etc.

If you call ahead most distillers are happy to give you a tour of their facility. If you swing by Overland (Dancing Pines) Distillery send me a PM, I'd love to buy you a drink.


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#7 JosephLabrecque

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Posted 07 March 2013 - 06:33 AM

Thanks for the info, all.

 

I do hear you regarding the merits of competition awards. That's simply how I heard about this particular absinthe.

 

@Evan - I'm basically never that far north but if I do venture up that way I'll be sure and ping you. Would be pretty neat to have a tour!

 

@TheLoucheyMonster - That's a neat idea! I know Leopold Bros. is in the middle building a new distillery. The various absinthe distilleries here are probably too far apart for anything organized though.



#8 Tirador

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Posted 14 March 2013 - 07:00 PM

I know a bit about REDUX ... but then again I make it.

 

If you're in the area why don't you come by and taste some ... and make your own determination as to what it is and isn't.

 

Also, I'll be teaching two hands-on Absinthe distilling classes during ADI in a few weeks and hosting a tasting that week as well.

 

We're at 412 Violet Street in Golden CO 80401. 

 

REDUX will be in full distribution in the near future.  For now, if you want to taste it you've got to come to me.

 

S.



#9 Tirador

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Posted 14 March 2013 - 07:02 PM

I heard something about how Redux used to be elsewhere, and then moved to Colorado. If they placed behind Trinity, they probably aren't that great.

 

THANKS ................... someone that's never tasted my product making statements about it.  And people ask why I don't usually post on the forums .....



#10 Alan Moss

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 01:31 AM

I know a bit about REDUX ... but then again I make it.

 

REDUX will be in full distribution in the near future.  For now, if you want to taste it you've got to come to me.

 

Interesting .. it is listed at Justice Snow's in Aspen: see page 10 of their list. I guess they are jumping the gun a little!


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#11 Joe Legate

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 03:41 AM

I know a bit about REDUX ... but then again I make it.


Also, I'll be teaching two hands-on Absinthe distilling classes during ADI in a few weeks and hosting a tasting that week as well.

 

.

Julie and I hope to be there.  I know of a couple more WSers that will also be in attendance.



#12 Brian Robinson

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 03:51 AM

$20 for a flamed La Fee? Not a bar I'll be visiting anytime soon...
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#13 Tirador

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 06:22 AM

I know a bit about REDUX ... but then again I make it.

 

REDUX will be in full distribution in the near future.  For now, if you want to taste it you've got to come to me.

 

Interesting .. it is listed at Justice Snow's in Aspen: see page 10 of their list. I guess they are jumping the gun a little!

Hay Alan ... don't we owe each other a call?  Anyway, I'm suprised Justice Snow's has it listed already as we're still in a holding pattern waiting for the Feds to approve us for the product produced at Golden Moon.  They are the largest on-premis seller of our gin (Golden Moon Gin) and are screaming for the Absinthe (as are several other local establishments here in Denver ... TAG, Green Russell, etc.) ... but no one has it yet.  I can let folks taste it at the distillery but I can't sell it until the Feds finish their paperwork.



#14 JosephLabrecque

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 06:36 AM

I know a bit about REDUX ... but then again I make it.

 

If you're in the area why don't you come by and taste some ... and make your own determination as to what it is and isn't.

 

Also, I'll be teaching two hands-on Absinthe distilling classes during ADI in a few weeks and hosting a tasting that week as well.

 

We're at 412 Violet Street in Golden CO 80401. 

 

REDUX will be in full distribution in the near future.  For now, if you want to taste it you've got to come to me.

 

S.

 

Ah - neat. I was pretty happy to see another Denver-area distillery producing absinthe :D

 

That's about 20 minutes away from my office. Do you do scheduled visits/tours?

 

What's ADI?



#15 Tirador

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 06:50 AM

We're open 9-5 Monday through Friday and 12 - 4 the first Saturday of each month.  We don't schedule visits/tours as a rule but if you want to talk Absinthe call ahead and make sure I'm in. 

 

I will be out most of next week for the Bar and Nightclub show in Vegas ... and then back in town for the next four weeks or so.

 

ADI is the American Distilling Institute (www.distilling.com).  Denver is hosting ADI's 10th annual conference this year ...

 

Anyway, feel free to come by and check out what we're doing ......



#16 Tirador

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 06:54 AM

 

I know a bit about REDUX ... but then again I make it.


Also, I'll be teaching two hands-on Absinthe distilling classes during ADI in a few weeks and hosting a tasting that week as well.

 

.

Julie and I hope to be there.  I know of a couple more WSers that will also be in attendance.

A few of my old HGer friends that help me out with things from time to time might be in the distillery at that time as well.


Edited by Gwydion Stone, 15 March 2013 - 09:16 AM.
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#17 fingerpickinblue

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 07:01 AM

$20 for a flamed La Fee? Not a bar I'll be visiting anytime soon...

They don't seem to be bashful about pricing in any category.


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#18 Ambear

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 08:22 AM



I heard something about how Redux used to be elsewhere, and then moved to Colorado. If they placed behind Trinity, they probably aren't that great.

 
THANKS ................... someone that's never tasted my product making statements about it.  And people ask why I don't usually post on the forums .....



 
Because you're going to call out strangers directly for making assumptions on your product (believe it or not, this is what all people who spot your product on a shelf are going to do, web forum or no) and can't take a gentle criticism? More helpful would have been more information regarding your product. What absinthes does it compare to? What style is it? What are the main flavor notes? This would help me to make a decision as to if I'd like even bother coming for a tasting...I really don't want to go even an hour out of my way to try a product that might not be very good. If you seem to know what you're doing, I'm a lot more likely to make an effort to give you my money, but if you're just another one of these new producers hoping to cash in on the popularity and mystery of absinthe (which there seem to be multitudes of at the moment), it's probably not worth it for me. The beauty of forums like this is that you can actually pitch your product to the people who care about it most, and are most likely to pick up a bottle of your work, if it's good. If not, it's a good way to get ideas of how to adjust your product from people who know what they're talking about.
 
I think Trinity is passable but I will probably never buy a bottle. If you're on par with Trinity, I'm probably not interested in your product either. I'll certainly try it at some point in time either way, but I'm not currently excited about it. How does it compare to other local brands, i.e. Leopold's?

Edited by Gwydion Stone, 15 March 2013 - 09:34 AM.
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#19 Evan Camomile

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 08:49 AM

I'd be more than willing to give it a taste test and even an honest review. As I said before I don't give much credit to spirit awards for absinthe, to the point of ignoring them. REDUX absinthe will tell me what it is, not some judge whose only experience with absinthe is one or two other brands. To be honest I don't even trust the ADI blind tastings when it comes to absinthe.

 

I'd love to be a part of the distilling class. The more I can learn about the art, the better reviewer I can be. I should probably see the guys from Downslope Distilling and Leopold Bros. again as well, it's been a long time.

 

Welcome to Colorado!


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#20 Gwydion Stone

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 09:44 AM

I have yet to see a spirits award organization whose absinthe credentials I have any confidence in, based on the results I've read. That's why I haven't entered any of them.  If I was making gin or whiskey, no problem, but there are precious few people in the industry who have enough experience and knowledge to judge quality absinthe.  [edited to add:] And they're mostly all making it.


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#21 Joe Legate

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 11:27 AM

. The beauty of forums like this is that you can actually pitch your product to the people who care about it most, and are most likely to pick up a bottle of your work, if it's good. If not, it's a good way to get ideas of how to adjust your product from people who know what they're talking about.
 
How does it compare to other local brands, i.e. Leopold's?

Mentioning Leopold is remarkable.  If anyone wants to see a real gentleman in action, read the early days of Leopold Bro.s Absinthe thread.  Todd replied to criticism with a grace that still amazes me and you can see by the batch-by-batch reviews reflecting his enthusiasm to learn and create a top notch absinthe.  It was a lesson that I am in his debt for a very long time.

 

That being said, I haven't had an opportunity to try Redux but I'm looking forward to it.



#22 Tirador

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 01:37 PM

Gwydion, this is the most recent version of the sample I sent you gosh maybe four or five years ago ... a little better perhaps but 85% the same recipe and procedures. 

 

It's been ages since we've chatted ... how are you?



#23 Gwydion Stone

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Posted 15 March 2013 - 06:44 PM

I'm good.  Still plugging away.

 

FYI, my remarks above weren't meant to reflect in any way on Redux or any other brand.  It was strictly a commentary on the state of absinthe in awards organizations.


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#24 Jack Griffin

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Posted 18 March 2013 - 08:16 PM

I wish you well, and I suspect this is going to be something I'll enjoy.



#25 Trinity Absinthe

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 01:30 PM

I must say, one thing that I truly enjoy about the spirits world, but most especially the absinthe world, is that there is room for variation. What suits one palate, may not suit another. Regions may add unique twists. I'm not quite sure what the point would be of having multiple distillers at any level if the products didn't each carry their own characteristics. I believe there is room for most. Last night, at the American Craft Spirit Showcase, there were four absinthe brands. Each one was completely it's own. I think that's how it should be. Each absinthe carries it's own story, if you will. You can learn about the sources of the ingredients, the choice of base, the care of the artisan putting it all together, the reasons why and why not, etc. Though there are certainly a few brands that do not personally appeal to me, I guarantee they have their own following of fans. Tastes differ greatly, even within a single person, day to day, depending on that person's mood, how they will be using the spirit (pairing? straight? mixed?)

 

It should be said that the same goes for judges. I whole-heartedly agree that competitions have their flaws, but I do think that they have a great place as far as getting recognition for sometimes very small, very obscure brands (as happened here!) Our absinthe has won several awards at this point, but much more than the medal, I like the fact that now, people outside of CO have heard of us. If they like it, great. If not, fair enough. If you are going to put your blood, sweat, and tears (hopefully not literally...gross) into your product, you'd better like it yourself. If you don't like your own product, it'll never work for you. Make what you like, honestly consider critiques--just don't anyone turn your whiskey into a rum--and hope the rest follows.

 

Happy to (soon) have yet another Colorado absinthe on the shelves! The more, the merrier!



#26 Evan Camomile

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 08:44 PM

 I'm not knocking either absinthe it's just I have this issue with awards and methods of competitions.

While taste, or any aesthetic, is ultimately subjective there are standards. Otherwise there would be no reason to name one spirit rum and another spirit whiskey. It would all just be booze.

 

It's for this reason that I loved the WS scoring experiment at the last festival. It showed how the system was great at taking a subjective experience and converting it to an objective score. The system itself is derived from historical sources of what good absinthe was at its height of popularity. For a spirit that spent the last century in a murky dark age, this is exactly what absinthe needs to make a true comeback.

 

This isn't without it's downfalls though. I absolutely love Leopold Bros. Verte but it got a 3.5 from me because of how awesomely idiosyncratic it is. That pisco base is a genius move, but also not a taste/texture in line with the system.

 

If you agree with a system then it's a great tool, but I will never call any system, anywhere perfect. It used to be my job to find backdoors and imperfections in systems, I know better.

 

Speaking of reviews, I need to go through my early ones and redo them blind. My knowledge and palate have come a long way since Pacifique and 1st Gen Obsello.

 

Happy to (soon) have yet another Colorado absinthe on the shelves! The more, the merrier!

Cheers to that! :cheers:


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#27 Trinity Absinthe

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 09:43 PM

While taste, or any aesthetic, is ultimately subjective there are standards. Otherwise there would be no reason to name one spirit rum and
another spirit whiskey. It would all just be booze.

 

Haha! So true... What I meant was that within the realm of each standard--and there should be a standard--there is room for variation. (After all, is absinthe without wormwood really absinthe?) I do agree that scoring rubrics and such add a heightened level of objectivity, but as you pointed out, when products don't fit nicely into the previously determined categories and characteristics, it can be hard to determine proper scores.

 

Would love to get to this year's festival!



#28 fingerpickinblue

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Posted 05 April 2013 - 07:36 AM

 I'm not knocking either absinthe it's just I have this issue with awards and methods of competitions.

While taste, or any aesthetic, is ultimately subjective there are standards.

 

Within your own statement, you actually make my first point.

 

I suppose that it is arguable that all taste and aesthetic experience is subjective... right up to the point where any standard at all is applied. This, however, is the point where the subjective/objective mix of evaluation begins to move away from 100% subjective/0% objective to something less than 100% subjective with a percentage of the experience being objective (if the person having the experience buys in to the standard(s). Better yet if the standards are legitimate.). Let's just stick to evaluation of absinthe for right now (since trying to apply this argument to, let's say, abstract art is beyond my pay grade).

 

I have done a ton of reading about absinthe in the last few years, and I can honestly say that I know of nowhere where there is a stated standard of correctness and character for absinthe in as relatively brief a format (about 3000 words) as the Review Tutorial here at The WS. This standard was originally written by people very knowledgeable on the subject, and further picked apart, parsed, tweaked and improved about a year and a half ago with the involvement of several others. In its current form it is a consensus of several highly informed opinions on the subject, and not just some "off the wall" manifesto by one individual. When diligently applied by someone with any reasonable experience level, it can result in a meaningful score outcome that reflects how well or not a particular absinthe adheres to the standard. And where consequential reviews are concerned, this is exactly what should be reflected. Let's face it. The Internet is littered with review sites for all kinds of things, and most of those sites apply no standards whatsoever. I suppose if one derives entertainment from reading whether Dick, Jane, Bob, Carol, Ted, or Alice likes or dislikes a particular product, then have at 'em. Personally, I consider most of them a waste of time since there is rarely any standard applied other than the individual writer's subjective (and sometimes stated objective) standards, and except for the rare occasion where that is articulated, one has no idea what standards were applied. And if one is guiding a decision by the aggregated scores on these sites, just consider that those scores are potentially the result of of as many sets of standards and points of view (stated or not) as there are individual reviews. So what does it all mean?

 

 

It's for this reason that I loved the WS scoring experiment at the last festival. It showed how the system was great at taking a subjective experience and converting it to an objective score.

 

To this day, I am still impressed by how that turned out. There is a good discussion about it starting here.

 

 

This isn't without it's downfalls though. I absolutely love Leopold Bros. Verte but it got a 3.5 from me because of how awesomely idiosyncratic it is.

 

I'm not sure I consider that a downfall. Remember, within our system we are evaluating against a standard, not against our own personal preferences. And in our standard, in two key criteria, observable idiosyncrasies and flaws require a score of 3. If that's the way you see it, you did exactly the right thing. Your preferences can always be stated in the comments. Interestingly, I have a review posted on another idiosyncratic absinthe (which coincidentally scored 3.5) in which I stated "Due to its idiosyncrasies, the score is what it is and doesn't really reflect how much I like it. If I were to ignore the review guidelines and reflect just that, the score would be about a half-point higher."

 

What's my point? My point is twofold; 1. Anyone has the prerogative to like or dislike any product of any type that they wish, based upon whatever standards they wish to apply for themselves, justified or not. 2. However in reviews here, and in the more academic discussion of how good or not an absinthe is, that conversation should be guided by well defined standards of correctness and character. The quality of any particular absinthe (or any alcohol beverage, for that matter) should never be determined by how much a particular individual likes or dislikes it.


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#29 fingerpickinblue

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Posted 05 April 2013 - 11:34 AM

And just when you all thought I was done.
 

I must say, one thing that I truly enjoy about the spirits world, but most especially the absinthe world, is that there is room for variation. What suits one palate, may not suit another. Regions may add unique twists.

 
I don't disagree with any of this as long as it is not an excuse to redefine what absinthe is, or to explain away a poorly made or otherwise unacceptable product. I, personally, am probably a little more tolerant of deviations from the mainstream with spirits products other than absinthe. In the case of whisk(e)y, gin, brandy, for instance, those beverages have a much more focused and understood identity with the consuming public than does absinthe. And yet, I can tell you that I tasted a "gin" a few weeks ago that the upfront aromatic and flavor characteristics were completely atypical and non-traditional in gin, so much so that I would be hard-pressed to consider it gin either by my awareness of identity or the TTB definition. So right now at this point in its resurrection, where absinthe is concerned, I'm all in favor of more conservative innovation, if any. There is plenty of room in the WS standard for individual expression. At the end of the day, what defines absinthe as far as I'm concerned is not whether it suits one palate or another, but rather that it conforms to a standard.
 
 

It should be said that the same goes for judges. I whole-heartedly agree that competitions have their flaws, but I do think that they have a great place as far as getting recognition for sometimes very small, very obscure brands (as happened here!) Our absinthe has won several awards at this point, but much more than the medal, I like the fact that now, people outside of CO have heard of us.

 
And this is the stuff all producers like. I happen to share the same skepticism that Evan does regarding most of these so-called competitions. If examined closely, it is obvious that most are a "buy a medal" program... enter your product, get a medal. I've taken a pretty good look, for instance, at the "Denver" competition site and there is no disclosure of any of the nitty-gritty of the protocol that convinces me that anything else is their intent. They even allow for several price categories into which to slot entries, which if manipulated could virtually guaranty every entrant a medal of the right hue. The category of absinthe is even more fraught with pitfalls than most others since there are so few tasters truly qualified to sit on a panel. In a review I still find laughable to this day, Mr. Paul Pacult (probably the most well-known spirits reviewer in the world) said about an absinthe which he rated 85-89 points "Aromas of popcorn, vinyl, wet cement and chalk". To anyone that knows absinthe, it should be clear that either his score is wrong or he doesn't know what absinthe is supposed to smell like. Personally, I think it's both (because I know what absinthe it is, and it is very middling). And I'd bet this particular absinthe would be awarded a bronze, if not silver medal in most competitions.
 
This is not necessarily a commentary on your absinthe. I don't know it at all. I'm just saying that under close scrutiny, the results of most of these events are fairly meaningless except to the uninformed who govern their consumer choices by scores and medals alone.
 


I heard something about how Redux used to be elsewhere, and then moved to Colorado. If they placed behind Trinity, they probably aren't that great.

 
THANKS ................... someone that's never tasted my product making statements about it.  And people ask why I don't usually post on the forums .....

 
This would be assuming that the judges got it right or even knew enough about absinthe to be consistent. We have all seen these events where some low quality offering has been awarded more highly than an offering of generally accepted higher quality.
 
My point again? See my summation #1 in the last post, and add to that my opinion that many times the statement of "to each his own" or "different strokes" or "what suits one palate, may not suit another" while all true in a vacuum, are simply unnecessary. As I said, no justification is needed to support one's subjective satisfaction. I do, however, think that many times those sentiments are thrown into the conversation to be dismissive of those who would agree with my point #2. 
 
 

 


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#30 Ambear

Ambear

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Posted 05 April 2013 - 11:53 AM

I don't disagree with any of this as long as it is not an excuse to redefine what absinthe is, or to explain away a poorly made or otherwise unacceptable product. I, personally, am probably a little more tolerant of deviations from the mainstream with spirits products other than absinthe.

 
Mmhmm. Some things like the absinthe's texture, quality of ingredients, or distilling mistakes are apparent when you taste it, if you know what you're looking for. I tasted a very well respected brand recently and it was VERY tailsy...saying "what suits one palate, may not suit another" just doesn't cut it in those situations...it's not that asparagus in my refreshing beverage isn't to my liking, it's that the distiller did it wrong.
 
My point regarding the placement of Trinity and Redux is this, since it seems to need more clarification: knowing that the whole purpose of Trinity being a middle-of-the-road, locally distilled answer to absinthes in the same quality range as Kübler and Lucid, it's been getting gold medals (a few times because, unless I'm mistaken, there wasn't any other spirit in the category that could have received the award.) I agree that a lot of people giving out awards who have no business judging, but I also know the likelihood of giving a silver medal to an exquisite absinthe that's going to be the next PF is low as well. I think if Trinity winning an award with another product to compare them against, that's a good thing...it means they can also get a gold when there's competition instead of being awarded it by default. Redux not getting a gold makes me more wary in buying the product.


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