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meatbag21

Pernod Absinthe Supérieure

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Alan I read your debunking myths section and it was a good read. Im just trying to get my head around the historical tree of Pernod vs Pernot where I understand the former is the conglomerate and the latter Le fils D'Emile PernoT run by Dominique Rousselet distills premiums from the La Parisiennes to Bdj, Roquette, Sauvage etc.. If there is an article which addresses this or someone who can explain please point me out the T from the D

 

Is the family from Henri-Louis PernoD unrelated to Emile-Ferdinand PernoT family line (which established the Emile Pernot et cie in pontarlier)?

 

The famous preban caches are labelled PernoD

Edited by gee13

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Pernod =/= Pernot

 

Here's a bit of history according to the US distributors of EP stuff:

 

The Emile Pernot distillery can trace its lineage to the first producers of Absinthe. In fact, Major Dubied, who had previously founded the Pernod distillery with his son-in-law, Henry-Louis Pernod, trained Fritz Duval, whose distillery eventually became Emile Pernot.

 

In 1895, the Deniset-Klainguer distillery was founded in Pontalier, France. The distillery became known for its absinthe and other liqueurs, including a very distinct herbal pine-bud liqueur. Herbal liqueurs such as these became extremely popular around France around the turn of the century, and the sapin liqueur produced at Deniset-Klainguer is the original sapin, produced using the same recipe they purchased from Cousin Florentin, the creator of the first sapin liqueur.

 

However, just over 110 years after it was founded, the distillery was in jeopardy of closing. Emile Pernot, a producer of distilled absinthes also from Pontalier stepped in to help. In 2006, they acquired the small family distillery to preserve its legacy and started working with their staff to revitalize their products, focusing on macerated absinthe and, of course, their wonderful sapin liqueurs.

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So Henri Louis Pernod was not related to Emile Pernot ..correct?

 

Preban caches currently were distilled by Pernod

 

So were there any remaining prebans from Pernot? given they were distilling since 1895?

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What I get from that is that Pernot stepped in to the Deniset-Klainguer distillery in 2006, so any pre-ban absinthes from the distillery that is now Emile Pernot would have been "Deniset-Klainguer" and not "Emile Pernot."

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I've got no idea about the pre-ban question but According to Emile Pernot's website there definitely were definitely Pernot branded abinthes in the 1890s:

 

"In 1889, the young Emile-Ferdinand Pernot, a native of the Fougerolles region, where he had trained as a distiller, joined the Parrot brothers and together they established "Emile Pernot et Cie” located at 1 rue du Mont in Pontarlier.


The first record of the firm at the Trade Tribunal is dated from October 1st 1889.
The very first Extrait d’Absinthe label for "Emile Pernot” appeared on October 12th 1889.
Emile-Ferdinand also registered many other brands, in particular "Pernot Emile”.
His son, Emile-Joseph, a survivor of the trenches at Verdun, later registered the famous name "Emile Pernot”."

 

There is a reasonable account of the history here (you may need to use google translate): http://en.emilepernot.fr/History-of-the-Distillery_415.html

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The nettles thing stood out to me too. Ive never heard of nettles being used for colouring so it seems strange that would have been part of the "original recipe." Has anyone ever read or heard anything about nettles being used in Pernod Fils?

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According to chemical analysis, nettles were never used in the recipe being used at the height of the brand's popularity. Also,

The extracts of other aniseed plants enhance the freshness and bring their contribution to the complexity of the product.

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That brochure is really interesting Alan, thanks for posting it. I particularly liked this bit:

 

"To what can we attribute this astonishing prosperity, this continuous development which only a small number of industries can boast? Quite simply, to the firm intent of the heads of the house of Pernod to always provide a superior product, never yielding to the temptation to realize greater profits by buying cheap raw materials of lower quality."

 

How times have changed for Pernod

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Has no one had a sample of the "original recipe" yet? I imagine a number of these have been floating around if they have truly been developing it for the past two years. Especially in recent months when it's been public knowledge.

 

Would enjoy hearing some impressions if they are out there... though I have pretty high doubts that this is much of an improvement over what is on shelves now.

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I think it cant help but be an improvement on what's out there, my bet is it will be a decent beginner absinthe like Lucid or Kübler or Lemercier but will still be a shadow of its former self (pre-ban PF) and have nothing on the PF1901

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But who really cares? Their crap sucks. You can't raise a thoroughbred from a mutt, I don't care what 'recipe' you have. And for all intents and purposes, they're only in it for the money. No passion = no good absinthe. (From what I've learned in my short time here.) So "screw 'em". I would rather devote my focus to passionate artisan distillers. Not greedy marketing giants hoping to cash in on the 'new' quality distilled absinthe craze. All this talk does is play them up so folks may buy a bottle just to see. "Not I" said the fly.

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I wont be rushing out to buy a bottle either, though If its not terrible I may end up getting a bottle to use in cocktails - I like all of the bottles in my collection too much to do that to them. But I don't' think we are their target market. There are a lot of casual, or potential casual absinthe drinkers out there who will never have the passion for it that we have and they ate the people who would buy this. And thats ok. For instance, I wouldn't join an online forum about craft beer and spend a small fortune on importing from microbreweries overseas. But that doesn't mean I don't like beer.

 

But I think Pernod is capable of producing a decent absinthe if they want to. The company owns Glenlivet after all and I wouldn't knock back a bottle of their 25yo scotch if someone wants to buy it for me.

 

So Ill keep on buying from Emile Pernot, Combier, Zufanek etc but I think even a decent 3 star Pernod absinthe can only be a good thing. For one thing if ends up pushing the czech crap out of some of the cocktail bars here Ill be very happy.

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For one thing if ends up pushing the czech crap out of some of the cocktail bars here Ill be very happy.

 

Straight up. I'm not looking to buy any of their stuff - but knowing where this stands in relation to a Lucid or a Kübler can certainly not hurt when advising others.

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If it is honestly made, and has even decent 'beginner' quality, it will be a positive development.

 

I agree with those who have said that we are not their target market. And I also agree that the could make a truly fine absinthe if they so chose. They have the resources.

 

But where they can potentially be helpful is in publicizing genuine absinthe to a much larger audience than any of the quality distillers we admire could ever afford to do. With their PR machine they could vastly advance the educational process and help kill the old myths, as well as the new ones like 'bohemian' rituals. The more people who are exposed to decent absinthe, and who learn what it really is, the better. There are countless people out there who could very well become enthused and start exploring, and inevitably moving up.

 

I just hope that their new recipe is genuine, and is of at least drinkable quality. It sounds like the first part will happen -- artificial colors are no longer in the mix -- but we can only wait to see what sort of quality they deliver.

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I completely agree on the PR machine. A Pernod Ricard that gets serious about promoting genuine absinthe, even if its not the best absinthe out there, can only be a good thing for the absinthe industry. They would be able to grow the market in a way no one else could and the benefits from that should flow on to the smaller distillers that we all love.

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Has no one had a sample of the "original recipe" yet?

Yep. Had it back in July. A friend and I got to sit down with the Reps to try it.

 

 

 

From my Facebook post about it:

 

It's very wormwood forward; tannic almost. Not the disturbingly bitter dryness of macerated wormwood, but more of a tannic dryness. Star anise is dramatically reduced. In fact, anise as a whole has been dialed down a lot. The wine base isn't very prominent. No tongue numbing like previous versions.

 

It doesn't taste like any pre-ban Pernod I've had.

 

image.jpg

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Yeah, I know... I said I wasn't going to do it, but I guess today I don't mind sounding grumpy.

 

Listen, it's either the "original formula" or it's not. If it is, why does it contain and why is it colored with nettles? If that inaccuracy exists, what else? If it's "a return to the original Pernod Absinthe formula" why did it take "a two-year process using the few remaining records of how Pernod Absinthe was made in the 1800s", and why is it described as being "based on the original absinthe recipe"? Maybe it's because they'd rather traffic in innuendo and implication rather than make a statement like "made in exact accordance". I mean what kid of crazy would ever do that? :twitchsmile:

 

I just copied and pasted the press release in a word document and then proceeded to highlight statements that are either known outright falsehoods or in conflict with other representations they make. So far I've counted at least 14 in the piece (go ahead, see if you can do better... you probably can). If you think this makes me sound crazy... not so fast. There's at least one other nut job here that might have done the same thing on another day... like maybe this one.

 

I'm not saying here that a move by Pernod Ricard to a more authentic model for their product is not a good thing. It's just the continuing gall to take a few baby steps and then make it sound like they're the second coming of Pernod Fils (replete with "here we come to save the day")... well, it's about enough to make my head explode. I can't imagine what kind of contortionist I'd have to be to blow that kind of sunshine up my own ass.

 

I think the most truthful statement I can find in the whole piece is "the change marks a new chapter in the brand's storied history". Yep, these guys have a story for everything. They remind me of what politicians and teenage boys do... whatever they have to say.

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