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Why I just banned Bogumil


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#31 Gruene Fee

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Posted 14 January 2011 - 01:29 PM

...a global hole.


Sounds painful.
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#32 Absomphe

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Posted 14 January 2011 - 03:16 PM

Indeed.

And that's no way to talk about Gaia. :laugh:

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#33 Babble

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Posted 14 January 2011 - 05:27 PM

If most of the reasons why he was banned are private, then I don't really understand why his banning was announced to the forum.


P.S.
I am still new and naive when it comes to internet forums so I guess the reason why it was announced like this is not apparent to me at this time.

#34 Brian Robinson

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Posted 14 January 2011 - 06:01 PM

It was announced because if it wasn't, people would be demanding we tell them what happened.
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#35 mgs

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Posted 14 January 2011 - 07:10 PM

secret reasons............. looks like federal investigations !

- mgs

#36 Brian Robinson

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Posted 14 January 2011 - 07:13 PM

The reasons aren't private, as they all boil down to the same stuff we've already talked about. Only some of the examples or sources are private, since they were told to members of the board in confidence.
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#37 mgs

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Posted 14 January 2011 - 07:19 PM

so, he, himself, gave all the evidences to be banned ? kind of stupid of his part..... maybe that is his style.... ok, don't want to stir again and again, but, I still do not understand why someone "makes a crime" in another country (other forum), and is punished here....

Was he a threat for the WS as an institution ?

To me he was just silly. He made me wonder many times if he was really saying serious things. Maybe he is just a crazy guy, like most of us have some kind of craziness.........

Anyway, I don't thrust "normal people", to be frank....

- mgs

#38 White Wolf

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Posted 14 January 2011 - 07:41 PM

mgs,

as I understand this it is not a crime, so there is not a public trial. The 1st ammendment does protect free speach, but it does not insure a conversation. The right to freedom of association is also protected, but it does not force anyone to associate. You can be asked to leave private property by the owner or their represenative for any reason.

I don't know all the reasons but untill proven otherwise I take this as a cautionary tale. I don't hate boggy. Infact I sometimes agree with him. Unless proven to my satisfaction that it was a wrongfull thing I support the moderators.

Jim
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#39 Joe Legate

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Posted 14 January 2011 - 07:48 PM

I still do not understand why someone "makes a crime" in another country (other forum), and is punished here....

Have you not been reading this thread? You have the reasons. Some of the information is private and will not be revealed. Sorry. It will not be revealed. Not for the source's privacy. Not for Boggy's privacy. You may not like it but that's the way it is. We have been as open as we can.

#40 OMG_Bill

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Posted 14 January 2011 - 07:58 PM

It was announced because if it wasn't, people would be demanding we tell them what happened.

Done is done. Let's move on.
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I mean no offense. There are bottles of extraordinary booze out there. I've tasted a few. Relax.

#41 LeRoy

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Posted 14 January 2011 - 09:16 PM

This was a long time coming...

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#42 Alan Moss

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Posted 14 January 2011 - 10:36 PM

There are posts here about privacy ..

You and I have exchanged several email and PMs over the years. Those are private communications and I would not share those without your expressed permission.


Some of the information is private and will not be revealed. Sorry. It will not be revealed. Not for the source's privacy. Not for Boggy's privacy. You may not like it but that's the way it is. We have been as open as we can.


Maybe too open. The first post here (already edited at my request) still includes a post from Boggy's Facebook wall. I believe his wall is set to being seen by friends only. If the Wormwood Society is really concerned about privacy, it should remove the screen grab of his Facebook post. Taking a post that is set to friends only and displaying it here is a breach of Facebook's Terms. If you really believe this ...

5. Respect Privacy
Privacy is important here. Information posted here may not be posted elsewhere without the express permission of the author. Public posting of information communicated in confidence is seriously frowned upon and may result in suspension or banning.

you should remove the screen grab of Boggy's FB post.

Edited by Alan Moss, 14 January 2011 - 11:27 PM.

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#43 m.a.mccullough

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Posted 14 January 2011 - 10:41 PM

i agree with alan here. We have no right to publicly post private info of anyone. On the other hand, anything put on the internet is technically public domain and if you don't want something publicly spread you shouldn't put it on the internet so.......

Edited by m.a.mccullough, 14 January 2011 - 10:43 PM.

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#44 m.a.mccullough

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Posted 14 January 2011 - 10:45 PM

But its not the WS's purpose to bash individuals, it is far off from learning and teaching the truth's of absinthe therefore I think only the info of the situation should be released here but maybe names and pix should be omitted. Just a thought.
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#45 peridot

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Posted 14 January 2011 - 11:34 PM

What's the best approach? Do everything possible to protect privacy or provide as much evidence as possible to convince everyone this was the right decision? Or how about trying to strike a balance?

Choose whichever one you want because all three doors are rigged with explosives. And so is the floor you're standing on just in case you decide to do nothing.

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#46 buddhasynth

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Posted 15 January 2011 - 12:08 AM

...pretty much.
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#47 m.a.mccullough

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Posted 15 January 2011 - 12:13 AM

Well I think the best approach is to take the approach that most stand by the WS's ideals that what I feel.
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#48 Brian Robinson

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Posted 15 January 2011 - 04:45 AM

The first post here (already edited at my request) still includes a post from Boggy's Facebook wall. I believe his wall is set to being seen by friends only. Taking a post that is set to friends only and displaying it here is a breach of Facebook's Terms.

Sorry Alan, you are incorrect.

From Facebook's terms of service, under privacy:

  • Some of the content you share and the actions you take will show up on your friends’ home pages and other pages they visit.
  • If another user tags you in a photo or video or at a place, you can remove the tag. You can also limit who can see that you have been tagged on your profile from your privacy settings.
  • Even after you remove information from your profile or delete your account, copies of that information may remain viewable elsewhere to the extent it has been shared with others, it was otherwise distributed pursuant to your privacy settings, or it was copied or stored by other users.
  • You understand that information might be reshared or copied by other users.
  • Certain types of communications that you send to other users cannot be removed, such as messages.
  • When you post information on another user’s profile or comment on another user’s post, that information will be subject to the other user’s privacy settings.

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#49 Joe Legate

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Posted 15 January 2011 - 04:54 AM

I understand Alan's point but no matter what we did, we knew someone wouldn't like it. It would either be too much or not enough information. How to give the membership enough information without crossing the privacy line is tough.

5. Respect Privacy
Privacy is important here. Information posted here may not be posted elsewhere without the express permission of the author. Public posting of information communicated in confidence is seriously frowned upon and may result in suspension or banning.

And yet, we are still being harangued to reveal private communications while we honor our own rules. (2 PMs for me last night)

Don't worry Alan, I won't reveal your penchant for wearing little black evening gowns. Ooops! ...No wait, that was J Edjar Hoover, not Alan. :laugh:

#50 Attack Accountant

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Posted 15 January 2011 - 05:59 AM

My two cents, late as usual, the man in the white hat is one of the most kind, forgiving men I've ever met. I do not question his decision to ban anyone. It is, after all, his forum. And he lets me stay.
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#51 mgs

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Posted 15 January 2011 - 07:13 AM

I did not find any white hat in this thread, the only white thing here is a wolf ! :sarc:

Well, if Boggy had "friends" who leaked his posts in Facebook to be excreted in another forum, he really does not need any enemy....

- mgs

Edited by mgs, 15 January 2011 - 07:14 AM.


#52 OMG_Bill

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Posted 15 January 2011 - 07:17 AM

I hesitated to add this but it's been my view as well....from the beginning.

I do not question his decision to ban anyone. It is, after all, his forum. And he lets me stay.

Imagine this place as a bar or country club or a private party where some guests are allowed. There may be something happening in another area that some folks are unaware of. The disturbance is taken outside usually without much notice. If the ejectee violated the rules/standards of the place and disturbed a few of the guests, wouldn't it be best to leave it at that and keep the party alive? Nobody wants to throw anyone out for giggles. This is just my personal opinion. Probably not worth $.02.
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#53 Absomphe

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Posted 15 January 2011 - 08:25 AM

And he lets me stay.


And me, even. :rolleyes:

And Marcelo, I think I was irritated over a few posts you made at the time, but that "Boggy's puppet" comment should have been prefaced with a :sarc: , but since it apparently wasn't, let me apologize long after the fact for the misunderstanding. :cheers:

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You got a problem with that?


#54 Jack Griffin

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Posted 15 January 2011 - 08:31 AM

For what it's worth, I've seen people put up with lots of BS here, and I can't imagine someone being banned casually. I'm certain that there were many PMs involved, and that if someone is being banned, they are told about it, and given at least one chance to turn things around. Perhaps more than one. I can't imagine
a banning being done lightly, and suspect that when it occurs, it is because the board's communications with the person in question were met with yet more negative energy; be it denial, refusal to accept things, or abuse. Gentleman typically have ways of putting their cards on the table and working things out.

I do agree that the photos are not needed, and can be perceived as unfair, as none of us would want our photos on a forum where we've been banned. I myself recently had a round of hurt feelings and misunderstandings with a couple of folks here, but we were civil and worked things out, realizing we all wanted the same things. I personally came out of it wiser, and with a better sense of how things work here. Some of us are new to forums in general, and there is a learning curve. Nothing was done in an abusive manner, and everyone's pms to me were very honest and open. I suspect "abusive" is a big part of things when someone is banned. I have faith that the board does all they can, and are very careful about such things.

#55 bksmithey

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Posted 15 January 2011 - 08:34 AM

Exactly right Bill. I treat this place like I'm a guest, and I behave in a way that I hope that if it were a bar, or private party, I'd be invited back. Pretty simple really.

I'd like to put in a word of agreement with Alan, please take down Boggy's facebook page snapshot (I see the other pics have already been removed). No matter what it says in facebook's privacy policy, it makes me a little uncomfortable to have it posted here, when presumably Boggy has set his privacy settings on FB to limit publication.

And, off topic:

On the other hand, anything put on the internet is technically public domain

Uh, no. There's plenty of copyrighted and other protected intellectual property "on the internet".

#56 Brian Robinson

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Posted 15 January 2011 - 08:52 AM

I find it absolutely hilarious how there is no winning solution. In the past, when there have been suspensions or bannings, people have been up in arms when the board didn't provide evidence as to why they were suspended or booted. People didn't want to be told why, they wanted to be shown the actual evidence.

In this case, we try to be more forthcoming, then we are criticized for abusing his right to privacy. At the same time, others have been complaining that we aren't sharing the private information that we choose not to disseminate.


Completely ridiculous.

We're never going to be able to please everyone. So let's just move on.
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#57 Alan Moss

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Posted 15 January 2011 - 08:58 AM

I understand Alan's point but no matter what we did, we knew someone wouldn't like it.

So who wouldn't like it if Boggy's FB post is removed?

Don't worry Alan, I won't reveal your penchant for wearing little black evening gowns.

Funny you should say that ...
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#58 bksmithey

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Posted 15 January 2011 - 09:02 AM

In this case, we try to be more forthcoming, then we are criticized for abusing his right to privacy. At the same time, others have been complaining that we aren't sharing the private information that we choose not to disseminate.


Completely ridiculous.

I don't find it ridiculous at all, it's just human nature. Some people want to stop and see all the gory detail at the train wreck. Others don't. No right or wrong answer, which is why there are a bunch of differing opinions being posted here. You (and the rest of the board members) have been dealing with it a lot longer than the rest of us, so you're ready to move on. The rest of us are just now tossing in our 2 c., so this will probably drag on a little longer.

Ok, I'm done now.

#59 Brian Robinson

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Posted 15 January 2011 - 09:02 AM

I understand Alan's point but no matter what we did, we knew someone wouldn't like it.

So who wouldn't like it if Boggy's FB post is removed?

PTFA. ;)

I think everyone who has needed to see it in order to understand the decision, has.
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#60 Ron

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Posted 15 January 2011 - 09:03 AM

We're never going to be bake to please everyone.


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